Social Media Success: Growing Your Audience & Attracting Investors Organically with Sara Smile Scott

Struggling with social media and finding it tough to attract an audience and investors organically? This episode of Girls in Property is tailored just for you! Join your host, Athena, as she chats with Sara Smile Scott, a social media strategist and expert in systematising social media efforts. 

For many business owners and property investors, managing social media can seem overwhelming and like an entirely separate job. Sara and Athena are here to break it down, offering practical tips and strategies for attracting your audience organically through effective systemisation. 

Tune in for an engaging and informative discussion that will boost your confidence in posting. Enjoy the episode! 

How to get involved with the Girls in Property Community 👇

🎄 Book your GIP Christmas Gala Ticket Today

👩 Join Our Community

🔔 Subscribe to our Mailing List

🎧Listen to our Podcast

🎬Subscribe to our GIP YouTube Channel

GET IN TOUCH

📷 Instagram

😄 Facebook

💌 Email us: girlsinpropertypod@gmail.com

Thank you to our main sponsor of this podcast Blanc Property Finance

Don’t Miss Out! Click here to claim your FREE access to the Mindset Accelerator Programme. Start developing the mindset you need to become an outstanding property investor today! 🚀


Disclaimer: None of the content in our podcast is intended to constitute legal or financial advice. All interviews ...

Transcript

0:02

Good morning everyone. And welcome to today's episode of the Girls in Property podcast. I hope everybody is doing well today. When I'm recording this, it is actually a Monday bank holiday. So happy Monday bank holiday to you all. But yeah, today I have a fabulous guest on the podcast who I'm so excited to introduce you to. She's got an absolute wealth of knowledge regarding all things to do with social media and how to really expand your business as well. So really tune into this and I'd even grab a notepad and pen for this one if I were you. So without further ado, I would like to introduce you to the gorgeous Sarah Smile Scott. Hi Sarah. Hi, Athena. Thanks so much for having me on your Girls in Property podcast. I'm really, really excited to be here. As I just said before, when we were starting, I would definitely get a pen and a notepad because when I get into the swing of things, there'll probably be a few eye openers to like, I did not realize that I'm now going to go away and implement because when it comes to talking about strategy, anyone that's watching and if you do have comments, Athena, I'm sure you do. Please do comment along, so I will check them along with Athena, along with Athena, should I say, because I want to make sure that you can actually take something away from this as we dive into things. Yeah, honestly, and I obviously did a strategy call with you recently for my own businesses and I was writing page after page of notes and it was just amazing. You taught me so many things that I didn't know or more should I say that things that I thought were the right way to do things and actually they were myths or not the right way to do things. And so you just gave me a different perspective. So I'm really looking forward to today's podcast. Yeah, well, think that's it for us, isn't it? Like as I get into it, and I will tell you a little bit about me in a second, but it's just so that forget, cause I think it's something that needs to be highlighted. And we were saying this just before, wasn't we around or in our session around how social media has evolved. And the one thing I want to say to everyone that if you are a business owner, really trying to navigate the platforms that please don't try and go down the virality route when they introduce reels. It really became this everyone's an expert for doing dances and lip syncing and it's really not about that. And I'll be diving into a little bit of strategy for you that you can kind of separate yourself. That's actually going to make you money in your business rather than growing a following. It's actually, they found you on one video that did well versus what you want is consistency. I love that. And we're definitely going to have a deep dive into that conversation. Before we do that, Sarah, could you please first start off by introducing yourself? And then you've got an absolutely incredible story. So please tell us your story and how you came to be who Sarah Smilescott is today. Yeah, do you know what? It's a really funny one, Athena. I decided we've all been there in the corporate nine to five. I'm sure anyone that's watching has done the whole, I'm going to work and try and get out the rat race. And I was in the farmer industry for about seven to eight years. I worked my way up. Literally the whole office thought I'd had a mental breakdown. I'd taken my mum to New York for her 50th birthday. And I was in New York in one of the rooftop bars and I just turned around to my family and just went, yeah, I'm handing my notice in when I get home. And they were like, what? I was like, yeah, I'm going to have my noticing because I feel that there's more to life out there. I'm sick of looking at a countdown calendar. If anyone travels, because I am a traveler as I'm going to get to, I had a countdown calendar on my desktop at work and it'd say like 46 days to your next trip or a hundred days. And when you're in that mentality of just sitting there constantly watching a calendar every day and the same white walls, you kind of think, is this life? Is this what I'm here for every day? Just coming in. getting an income and then waiting to go on the next vacation or whichever. So I decided, you know what, forget it, I'm just gonna go live in Bali, just booked a one-way ticket and I just left. People were like, there is something wrong with her. She's literally lost her mind. And I thought, do you know what now, with the housing prices going up and everything, know there's a lot of you in property that we've had different things that have happened. Obviously at the time I was single, I was like, I'm not gonna get a house. on my own, on my dream house, because that was what we were conditioned to back then. It was like, buy a house, get married, settle down. And you know, that's kind of it. And I'm just not that person. I'm very much like, there's so much more out there, so much to being independent and making an income for ourselves. So when I got to Bali in 2017, this was the peak of Instagram influencers. Everyone was in Bali doing like the whole waterfall shots, the cafe shots, the beach. So I thought, do you know what? It can't be that hard. Here we go. It's not going to be that hard. Get my phone, take some pictures, and I'll make money. No, it's not that easy. For anyone watching that thinks becoming an influencer is just taking a picture, it really isn't. So when I was out there, I had a lot of time on my hands. And I saw a lot of people in different cafes, loads of nomads, loads of laptops. So I'm a very outgoing person for the fellow extroverts out there. So I just literally ran to me, start talking to people, like, what do you do? And they'd be like, I'm a graphic designer, website designer, social media manager, influencer. And I just started asking questions about how they got into it. And then I was quite lucky that I decided to open a Facebook group because I was like, do you know what? It can't be that hard. I'm actually going to take people on the journey with me to inspire others that are maybe in the same position that I was that wanted to earn money for themselves. So I'd invested like we all do. certain courses, some I got ripped off with, it's the standard isn't it, there's some out there with absolute nonsense, others that were all right, and it was all about influencing it first because this was the goal, it's like I'm going to be this amazing influencer and honestly it wasn't from a vanity point, it wasn't about look at me, look how good I am, it was more about I wanted to work out how I could meet these tens of thousands of pounds that everyone was talking about and the reality was If you didn't have a drone, professional camera, Photoshop, all these tools, it technically wasn't possible because back then Instagram, we didn't have reels, we didn't have stories, we didn't have any of these other features. fact, back then they'd only just released guides and IGTV if anyone remembers before it became everything reels. It was just a static post feed. So it was more on how viral your pictures could go. So you needed the software with it. Well, anyway, the more I was like looking into these courses, I was like, why is no one really kind of using the same strategies for businesses? And at this point I was setting up a business. So I thought I'm going to go against the grain here and I'm going to start to support small businesses. Cause that's what I was at the beginning on how the tools has already got. How can we use this to actually elevate not just how influencers make money, but organic growth for a business. So I started talking about it in my Facebook group. And again, back then Facebook was a big platform. Everyone was using it. was before TikTok and Pinterest and all these different platforms that were out there. In fact, it was even before Snapchat, even though Snapchat existed. It wasn't the Snapchat we have today. And from that, people were just blowing up, asking me questions of like, how have you done this? Can you help me? I started like engagement threads, like follow threads, because these were all strategies that worked. If you were doing it correctly. the feeds that I do would like, if you're a travel account, follow each other here. If you're a fitness account, follow each other here. And I was basically categorizing everyone in this Facebook group and everyone started to see results. Even when hashtags were a really big thing, I'd worked out how to get tens of thousands of views from actually understanding hashtags, because a lot of people think, and this is still knowledge today that you should really think about. When people are putting stuff like Mother's Day is coming up or Valentine's Day, something along those lines. And you're having a good time and you put a hashtag Mother's Day. You've completely confused the platform because hashtags, they're like a massive filing cabinet. So if I was to go and look for you, Athena, in the like property industry, I'd be going down to property, looking in the property cabinet, looking for like your podcasts and different things are all in categories that I would then find you. If you've then added hashtag Happy Mother's Day on it. It's kind of like, well, that's a completely different category. So why would you put that on there? Does that make sense? So even today, it's the same thing. Imagine it's like old school, a massive filing cabinet. You always just want to keep it. If someone was to physically go into a filing cabinet, what category would they find them under? So for you, it would always be about, you know, podcasts, property. like renovations, flips, HMOs, you wouldn't really want to come out of that. You just always want to stay there. Even if it's a birthday, especially occasion, Christmas, Halloween, no one should ever be putting those hashtags on because when they do, Instagram isn't smart enough to actually visibly see any of your content. It's all numbers attached to it. So it all works where they connect them together in the dots to where they're going to push it out to a similar audience or an audience that's already searching that. So that's why we need to make sure, especially with hashtags, we keep it in the right category. That's fascinating. didn't even see another thing you've taught me. I didn't even think about that. And people used to go crazy with hashtags, know, like hashtag YOLO and all of that. And so that's actually a really, really good tip actually, which is just keep it very specific to what it is you're trying to target as it were. And I think it makes it easier when you can visualize something. I'm a visual learner, so I'll always use like a product that's physical. Like I said, that filing cabinet, as long as we're all in that mindset of if I was to actually look for myself in that filing cabinet, what would I categorize myself as, sorry, and go with it? And it's the same people. still the whole hashtags. Should you use them? Should you not use them? Like, what's the myth around that? Adam always confuses us on Instagram. Adam Mazzari, one minute he'll say on a podcast, I know they don't work, like don't bother using it. And then on another one, he'll say, yes, you should use it. But for us in the business world, it's still like SEO, it's still search engine optimization, because I will still, and if you do let us know in the comments, when it comes to like restaurants, if I know, mean, Athena will get to this, we're going to LA for an event. I've already checked on Instagram, like. Venice beach cafes, I'll search that as a hashtag to see what comes up or things to do in LA. And then people pop up as a business. If you're looking for a property mentor coach, then you would search property mentor coach. So there is still a reason why you should be using them, not to necessarily think you're going to get loads of views. Just what is that person going to search in that top bar? That's going to get me found. That's going to lead to a follow or even better a conversation. So why still use them? The only thing I've changed, which I do believe is from Instagram, even though you're allowed to use up to 30, if you're using the full 30, it may confuse the app now because Reels and Static Feed, they're actually two completely different algorithms which I'll get to that if you put too many hashtags in, it confuses it to where it'll just cancel them all out. So if you are using hashtags, Reels I would only use up to five and that was they told us that themselves two years ago and then with your posts I probably wouldn't go over 10. I'd just keep them quite minimal just so they don't get cancelled out. Okay, so 10 for a post and then five for reels. Okay, perfect. I'm going to rethink my whole hashtag situation now. That was really good. Thank you. We got a bit of nugget right at the beginning of the podcast, which is fab. And then before we go any further, Sarah, one of the traditions on this podcast also, which I don't know if you are aware of or not, is that we always talk about something that we're celebrating at this moment as well. So we try and always think about, okay, we celebrating something this week or something that's just happened. So what are you celebrating at the moment for yourself? If I'm honest, what I'm celebrating and as we're always evolving and I will go through this with the platforms, I think for me, it's like how much I've changed over the course of the last seven years. Like when I started, it was just the one -to -one side that I did because I didn't really know anything else. And exactly like this podcast, it's so much easier to get so informal with each other, just really get to know each other that now I've really got like different processes from like my one -to -ones. I've recently now restarted an accountability group, which is completely free. And the reason for that is everyone struggles with accountability for posting. We all give up sometimes. If we don't think we're making any headway, we're like, I'm not going to bother. And really with the apps, all of them, not just Instagram, Facebook, I mean, every social media platform, it's about consistency and they will take that for themselves. We went over this in depth, Athena, that as long as they can start to see that you're going to commit. to a certain day every week and stick to that exact day over time, they will start to favor you because they can see you're actually supporting their app. You're getting users on it and you're active. So it's really helping those that don't give up because when you give up, it's like starting all over again. You're having to like rebuild trust. Say I'm in a relationship with Instagram and it's a person. You're having to rebuild that trust with them to be like, yeah, but I'm a good user. Like I am doing this. And then you've got to wait again. So. Yeah, the things I'm proud of, it's definitely that I've relaunched a different Facebook group and reviving that. Got my one -to -ones, got my membership and also as well speaking, like celebrating going to LA for being a speaker. So there's so many things. It's amazing and the wealth of knowledge that you have and what I love about you particularly is that you do it in such a fun way and you make it really, you make it make sense. You don't use fancy words that confuse everyone just to try and position yourself as this expert. You're very down to earth. You're loads of fun. And yeah, I think you should celebrate this evolution of yourself and what an amazing decision you made on that rooftop to go, no, there must be more to life than this. And you've proven that there is. So good for you. It's great. news is that Athena will be celebrating it because I think it will be my eighth year whilst we're in LA. So yeah, so there'll be a little celebration, cheers. It's like my eight year anniversary. Yeah. do. There's loads to celebrate in LA actually. There's so much. So it's so exciting. Well, yeah, I'm going to be 33 in it. I'm going to turn 33 in LA at the Wealthy Women CEO retreat, which is a kind of cool sentence to say. it is, and to be fair you don't look 33 at all. you. yeah do you know what it's weird some people I get mistake it's very weird actually at the moment I either get mistaken for like a 25 year old where I'm like I will take that or like someone the other day and don't get me wrong it's only one person that's ever said this to me but like they thought I was like 36 and I was like my god that is I'm having a bad day I'm having a bad day yeah and it was the wrong side of the bed. you know what though people keep telling me not to it seriously because it was like an old guy and they're like that he doesn't know don't worry he hasn't got a clue got to take it with a pinch of salt. I mean, to be fair, it sounds frustrating that I definitely look over the age for alcohol and paracetamol and stuff. Sometimes if I get ID for that, think really like I don't even carry my ID around with me anymore. So when I get ID for stuff, I'm like. I'm really like pass that exam just a year older than you, so I'm 34 and I'm like, I'm 34 years old. Yeah, we did get a compliment, but you know, you're in the Tesco's. And you're there and they're like, have you got any ID? And I'm like, no. And they're like, sorry, we can't sell you that. that would be, to be fair, that would annoy me. Like if I needed some paracetamol, I need paracetamol. I'd be like, please don't annoy me with this. I'm not in the mood. the paracetamol you get away with, but it's the alcohol. they're like, yeah, but we've got the 25 rule now. And I'm like, yeah, 25. But I definitely look over 25. And once they've asked you if you can't provide it, apparently it's against the law. They're like, we really can't give you it. And I'm like, OK. Yeah. yeah. Yeah, so we've got lots of celebrate and then what am I celebrating at the moment? So I'm actually celebrating the fact that I'm hoping it's going to be this week. I think it is going to be this week, but I've got, I've got a really cool announcement coming. can't, I can't, I can't divulge too much information. I think, you know, but I'm not sure if you know, but there is, there's an exciting, how can I explain this? Leveling up. of Girls and Property that is coming. So you know you're talking about evolution. There is something I'm waiting for to come through for Girls and Property that I'm then going to announce. And once it's done and I can announce it, I then have plans to take Girls and Property to new heights. And the exciting thing is, is I'm not doing it on my own. I'm doing it with others. So I'm really, really excited about it. And I just can see, you know when you have a business, Yeah. you have an idea and you can just see the road and the path in front of you and you can see it clear as day for your business. And I'm just so excited to be like, okay, let's go. And sometimes I have to rein myself back in and always remind myself it's a marathon and not a sprint. And that's quite difficult for me, but I just see so much growth and more than that, I can see what girls in property means to others and what it does for others. And that's actually what drives me with the business. I can actually see the impact it's having. yeah, watch this space, really exciting. Everything should be in place by the time we get to LA. So yeah, really cool. think that's That's amazing to celebrate. But I think just for words of wisdom for anyone that is watching Athena, that like even taking those risks, like when you're fully invested, just push through with it and it will work out. And I always like to remind some of my clients have been struggling recently. If they feel like they're not making any headway, it's like just don't give up because that's where that other 99 % do give up. It's just believe in the vision. And your mind achieves what the mind believes as they say, just keep pushing through. Absolutely and we can, I could do a whole, in fact I'm gonna do it, I could literally do a whole podcast about all the failures. In fact I think I did, well I did a podcast all about my top five mistakes from my first two years but like there are so many things that went wrong, so many times I wanted to quit, so many things and let's face it like there's still a long way to go even now and even I have moments where I go my god there's just so much work to do, like can I do it? It's great that you've said that because this is another thing that I get really frustrated with that people, everyone fails with launches. have many times, like people that come out and say they're a successful entrepreneur and blah, blah, blah. It's like, yeah, but how many times did you fail? It's okay for some people to have that insecurity to not want to admit failure. I completely get that and respect it, but I do think it needs to be normalized. Like even what's seven years on in my journey when I was living in Greece in 2021. I did a launch there. Maybe it was the geographics. Maybe it was just the timing. It was the school holidays. It was a complete fail. And it was only, it was only a low ticket thing as well. And I was like, I'm going to have to go back and relook at my launch process and things that I may have missed. And honestly, I still can't see where I'm wrong. I just think at that time, it just wasn't needed. People just had too much going on. You accept it, you reflect, and then you move to the next thing. is the thing and you know what I sometimes I feel like when things don't quite go well like a launch sometimes you can actually take it quite personally and almost like that person it isn't buying from you as a person like and it's not that it's really not it's about the idea of was it the right time as you said let's face it at this moment there is a lot going on in the world itself and you know people are being stretched left right and center for their income right now as well Yeah. so they've got to be really, really picky with how they spend their money. And that is so important as well. And you've got to, you can't just have this rite of passage and assume that you're going to put something out there and everyone's going to buy from you and worship you. Like you have to, as you said, you have to build that trust. They have to get to know you. I think somebody said to me the other day, this was a completely separate conversation, but somebody said to me the other day, a person buys from you after at least eight points of contact, I think it is. And that's quite a lot if you think about it, you know the thing is, this is where it all changes, isn't it, that's eight points of contact, you've got that. Then you've also got apparently from psychology, it's either they have to see it 21 times. So I mean, you'd have to actually put your offer across your socials 21 times for like programming. I think there's so many different ways of how people do it. But personally, for me, and I don't know if it's the same for you, Athena, anyone that's worked with me, yes, I would say they've been in my circle a little while. I've had the odd few that have just jumped straight in and that's absolutely fine. But a lot of the times, I think everyone's trying to figure out, I gel with this person? Like, does this person have the information, the knowledge that I need? But I'd say most of mine, I'm a live person. I like to go live to really start to explain things as we're doing here so that people have a better understanding of like, what Sarah just said there, that's my gap. So I'm gonna reach out and just ask her a question about it. When it comes, and my stories actually, my stories always do really well. I am a story person. I'm obsessed with them. But in terms of like my static posts, I wouldn't say I get much from that. Maybe they'll go into my DMs, but I couldn't really say that I've had many from a static post. But I think it's you are who you attract. And because I am a talker, I'm a social person. I think you really want to be attracting the right audience because again, what's not often spoke about, and this happens to me right in the beginning, not for years now. but I would take on any person in the beginning, because you're on that high and like, yes, it's working and the dopamine's kicked in and yeah, I've had some terrible, not terrible clients as in they were bad people because no one's a bad person from that sense. But if you didn't really gel and you've given like their expectations is up here, but you've said this is what you'll get at this level. And it kind of like, this is really tricky that what you don't want as an entrepreneur is to then actually having to deal with that person and dread it. And that was me at one point. I would dread turning up to that call like, this person's like expecting me to be a magician when I've explained it takes time. know, instant results. People feel on social media as a whole that if you post once, you'll get instant results. That just isn't right. It doesn't happen like that. And that's the point we're making right now with you. Like you said, eight points of contact, psychology, 21 times seen a post and working out. And that's all it comes down to is trial and error, same with social media. what works for you, that's your skill set, keep doing more of that rather than trying to like wear all the hats and try everything because the chances are you're going to burn out or attract an audience and clients that you're like actually this isn't what I wanted. Exactly. So I'm going to ask you a couple of different sets of questions if that's okay, just because your knowledge is amazing. And I want to almost ask different questions that should hopefully hit a different type of audience member listening to this podcast, depending on what stage of their social media journey that they're at. So let's start from the beginning, which is I often get asked when I'm either mentoring a person or somebody who's just messaging me on social media, to say, hey, Athena, like, can you please give me some tips about what I should be posting on social media? Now, just for reference, Sarah, they might not be actually like a coach looking to like take on clients, but they might be looking for investors. They might be looking to position themselves as an expert within property. So when someone says, what should I be posting? What do you think is a good answer to that? Well, I'm just going to cut it back a second because you know me, Athena, with this. I think before anyone is thinking about posting, and obviously you know how, have the knowledge of this. So if you ever sign anyone up, you do know it's really about making sure that first of all, the app itself, so Instagram understands exactly who you're trying to attract. Now this may get confusing. So please do make some notes. When you first open your Instagram, you'll have your explore page. And I know some people think the minute I say this, what on earth is an explore page? So if you're on the first page, it's the magnifying glass at the bottom. That should actually be a clear reflection of you as a business owner. So as Athena knows, if I go onto mine, it's very much motivational women. see like Instagram, real suggestions, Canva prompts, chat GPT for Instagram captions, and then female entrepreneurship. So if a complete stranger was to go onto my explore page. they would instantly know this is clearly a woman business owner. We don't know exactly what it is, but maybe it's social media because of the diverse content that we're seeing. If you've opened Jaws and you're on this magnifying glass when you first opened Instagram and you see like the latest Zara Hall, cute animals, babies, but yet you're in property and you see nothing of property like the most common, think is like the home decor transitions, because a lot of people watch them, even just the general public. then you're already setting yourself up for failure because Instagram, and the best way can explain it is if everyone's seen the film, Matrix, we all know what that is. All those digits is basically what Instagram sees. They cannot see the actual real or image. All they can actually see is the numbers attached to it. So it's kind of like a dot to dot. They're looking at your explore page. It's got property on there. It's got investors. It's got chappy GPT prompts for how to do property development, it's got builders, it's got maybe Ikea on there. All those dots, sorry, all those numbers Instagram can see in the back end that then they're putting the dots together to look at a similar audience that's looking at that to then push that out to that person or that person of interest. Does that make sense, Athena? yeah and do remember when we did it with mine and when you said click on your magnifying glass and do you know what just came up loads and loads of dog videos exactly. So really for you, and we're going to use you as an example, Athena, I hope you don't mind. So, so Athena's obviously in the property world, we know this, but Instagram's sinking, Athena's posting all this property value and information of like all the women hookups and yet on the explore page, it's dogs. So do we show our content to dog lovers or do we show a content to other women that are in the property? And the minute there's any confusion in an app. any platform because we know how it's evolving now, it's getting extremely smart, they just won't show your content or if they do, you'll get very minimal reach. So what you want before you post in is to actually be able to see what I call a mirror mirror reflection. We want your feed of what you're posting to be a reflection of categories that's on your explore page because then you're already setting what I call a triangle that you've got Instagram to start. the explore page here, your content here, and then it guides the content to an audience that's interested in that, that may be a potential customer. Okay, that makes complete sense and you know, we went through this together. I suppose my only question about this would be, by the way, I'm really interested in the answer to this. sometimes I'll want a day off from having to do like business Instagram in my brain. And I might just want to look at some gym stuff because I'm back in the gym now. And I might want to look at some funny videos of dogs. Like, how can I, I still want to be social on my social media platform. Yeah. I'm going to be honest, I have a separate account for it. It's just a private one. it's just, honestly, it's filled with nonsense. It's just got, I'm into the gym, but mine's from the gymnastics point. My travel, sorry, just to give everyone a background, I've got a travel account, a business account, and then what I call a crap account. So my travel one stays everything travel. My business is everything business. And then my crap account, as I like to call it, is just filled with nonsense. It's like clothes, gymnastics, like random safe stuff because of my partner when I'm looking at stuff for him. So I have that separate. Now, most people don't like having different accounts for things, which is absolutely fine. But that one, you can just have it as private. And because you've got the integration now, which you already know this, Athena on Instagram, you can have up to five accounts. If you just double click your profile at the bottom, the little circle of yourself, it swaps to the other one. So it's very easy to go in between that you don't really need to do anything with it. It's just if you're looking for stuff or you want to have a little bit more of enjoyment, that's what I would recommend that people do. Right, that's what I'll do then. I'll create a private account and I'll have all my dogs and all gym stuff over there. Yeah, yeah, you don't ever have to post anything on it or anything like that. You can just have it for that purpose. or another way of thinking, if you're not on TikTok, you could just have it on a TikTok because TikTok is easier to navigate for that kind of stuff as well. true. mean people keep telling me that I have to get on TikTok. They're like if you're not on TikTok you should be getting on that, particularly for girls in property. So that probably will be coming at some point. So yes, eventually. to get me back on for that. TikTok's a different conversation for me. I did launch a course for TikTok back in 2020 when it first started. I'm not on TikTok now, just that, you I do have an account there, but the reason I stopped and it might be, you might think, she's spat her dummy out a bit there, is I literally built a course, got all the ladies on it with me and they really favor Canadians, sorry, my client's Canadian. They really favor Canada, Australia and America. So I already had, I think 3000 followers head start cause I had to learn it, understand it, build a course and then sell it. And literally they all overtook me in a week, literally a week with the strategy. Yeah. One of them now, she's a really big TikTok educator and it's all from my car. She's called wave wild. If anyone wants to go watch, she's still active on there. I'm not. She's got like 300 ,000 followers now educates on how to use TikTok. And for me, because they weren't giving the UK the reach. I just was like, it's not for me. I jumped off the platform. No, no, they don't. If you try and find a UK non -celebrity business owner on there that does our kind of niche, you'll struggle unless it's viral content. But educators were already at like a negative response anyway, and that's across all the platforms. So whereas we were saying at the beginning, When it comes to this virality, we're all trying to jump on it to get that hit of like, feel like I'm successful. And honestly, that's the wrong mindset. What you want to be able to do is get your audience to convert because businesses as a whole on Instagram, we've got maybe like no more than 17 % from the latest statistics. So you think about the whole of Instagram with UCG creators, viral content creators, like brands, celebrities. We're a very small niche as a whole for like small female business owners or big female business owners. It doesn't matter. It's not what everyday people want to see. So you've already at a disadvantage. So instead of looking at like, why does this person get hundreds of thousands of views and whichever you want to be in the mindset of I'm already at a slight disadvantage that I can make into a success knowing that there's only 17 % on the whole platform. So you're not going to get that. you've decided to come off of TikTok then. Yeah, that that statistic, sorry, was for Instagram. But sorry, I apologize. The statistics I just gave there were for Instagram. TikTok's much less than that. I think it's like five. And that's because the differences, which mean you would do really well on TikTok, just let you know, Athena, if we got the reach. It's very raw content. They're not looking. Instagram is about like curating, like editing and making it look in a certain way for most of us. But TikTok, it's People prefer raw content. They prefer it when you just randomly rock up, start talking or share different things. They're not looking for the pretty transitions and things. Wow, that's so interesting. And then just going back to my original question, because I just want to go back to make sure that they, because I can feel like all the listeners with their pens and papers going, wait a minute, go back to that question, is say that somebody comes to me, because this happens to me all the time, Sarah, like literally, I'd say like once every other day, somebody will say to me, okay, you're telling me I should be posting more because I tell everybody to get out there, show yourself, tell everybody what you do. And then like Athena, that's great theoretically. what should I be posting? So what would your answer be? I think the tips I would give is one, would review your post first that you've been putting on. So whichever has been performing well, the audience you've currently built, that is what works well for them. That would be one advice that I would do is keep recreating a similar style of that content so that it's keeping the active audience still engaged. But when it comes to your investors and trying to get them, I will be putting up value posts that explain why an investor should be looking at you, but even be direct. So like I always say to my clients, like anyone that you're working with, and it's in a non -patronising way, we need to be speaking to people like the five years old, because if it's not as simple as possible, it's going to overcomplicate it and not make it clear. So what would an investor be looking for from your profile? Like what do they want to see? If you're struggling with an answer for that, literally chat GPT it, like just put in chat GPT. what 10 posts should I do on my Instagram that would interest an investor to show that I have the capabilities for them to work with me? And then you've got some content that you can think, yeah, that might work for me. I'll go with that. It's not about sometimes vanity. Like I say, if you look at my travel account, you probably think, Sarah was a bit vain back in the day, because they're all single images. But that's what worked at the time as we've gone over. now it's more about what value can we present? that's really going to build that trust and that confidence within a person that will result in them wanting to reach out to me. They were the tips I'd say to do it. But then the third tip I would be that's related to content but isn't, but make sure you're following investors that you want to see work because they may just randomly follow you to see what you are doing. And when the time's right, I would say if you're confident enough, put yourself out there and just ask. There you go. Exactly that. And I think you're so right. I think it's really about, I always say to people, as you said, always give value. Because if you give value, then people will naturally come to you. So for example, your example of this might be that you'll do a reel or a story or a live about teaching someone about hashtags. And therefore they then look at you and go, Sarah knows what she's talking about. I better get in contact with her. know, listeners, if your thing is at the moment you're doing by refurbished rent refinance, HMOs, rent to rent, service accommodation, whatever it may be, just give lots of information, lots of value to position yourself. And I also always say, and I don't know that some people agree with me and some people disagree with me, I'd be interested to know your opinion on this Sarah, is I always say also put your personality out there. Like, you your posts don't always have to be so serious. You know, some of my best posts at the moment are the ones where I'm taking the absolute piss out of myself. Yeah. I'm like, life is so boring sometimes and let's just have a laugh and let's just be silly. And I just think then people are like, okay, she's cool. She positions herself as the expert, but she's also down to earth and knows how to have a laugh. And I think that's important. Yeah. Do you know, I was literally about to say that with great minds think alike. I was literally about to say, and don't forget as well, more on your stories. You can do posts on it as well, but stories is more what I like to say the behind the scenes so people get to know the real you. But nine times out of 10 people, if they like you and they're then going to trust you from your value posts, they're 100 % more likely to work with you. And like you said there, it's about making a fool out of yourself. A lot of mine have gone the best. It's all my fails. I will share my day -to -day life when I failed. Before I went to Greece, I tipped a full thing of coffee over my laptop. I had to use a bike. I'd sold my car at this point because I'd sold it before went traveling. I've got another one now, but before I had to get on a bike and bike for six miles to the nearest Apple store. This was all documented. People remember it. I've shared about losing my hair when I traveled Thailand. absolute disaster. look like Edward Scissorhands. People love that story. Lockdown how I cook my eggs randomly because I poach eggs with just water, which people don't understand how it stays together. Like just those random facts. And sometimes I forget and someone will say if I end up getting a one to one client, they'll literally be like, yeah, I remember when you lost all your hair. And I'm like, you've been following me for like three years then. Yeah, little things like that. It sticks with them and they remember and I'm like, Strange, I completely forgot about that moment in time, but that's the things that you want memorable. You want people to remember that happened because then they have that association with you of like, well, when Athena did this and then when they work with you, they'll remind you of it. And that's happened to me loads. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Mine's more like the podcast as well. lot of people find me through the podcast now, loads of people. Well, I always say, how did you find me? And they always say the podcast. And they'll say, I remember in this episode when you spoke about this property disaster. And I'm like, my God, that was ages ago. And it's mad. It's wonderful. Cool. therefore guys, listen to Sarah and it's all about... posting good value, being a person of authority and giving rather than expecting to receive I always say if you give lots and lots you naturally will attract the right people to you and I always tell people to be social on social media as well, comment on other people's posts, follow other people that inspire you within the property world or wherever it may be and try and be as social as possible I always try and give that bit of information as well which is always good. Yeah, and that's it. You've got to remember that when it comes to social media. I am actually getting a t -shirt printed that says be social on socials. It's actually a massive part. Again, I know this is a little bit more Instagram related than anything else, but it's the same on all platforms. An app, just a bit of a background, is looking for the most activity. It's how they rank as number one. We think because Instagram is so established now and all the other ones that, well, they're done. They're a multi -billion company. They still want to be number one on the top of the social charts that we have on like the Apple and the app store and everything else. And for that to happen, it's based on user activity. So they'll start to reward you more in terms of reach and that connection with the audience. If you're more active on it. And again, it's strategies in it. I wouldn't say just engage on anything again, Instagram's a robot. It collects the data. So if Athena's engaging on property or upcoming property developers or ladies that are interested in listening to a property podcast, the chances are that when she next posts, Instagram will show it to the audience she's been engaging with on the explore page. It's very smart in how it pushes the content when you start using it strategically, because it, like I want to keep saying, it's not about the numbers. I know there's a massive vanity thing. I remember when I very first started teaching Instagram for business. Does everyone remember when you used to have to have 10 ,000 followers for the link in your stories? It was called the swipe up. It's not called that now, it's just called a link. And the main goal with every person I worked with was I want 10 ,000 followers for the swipe up. That's all they wanted. And what happens with that is yet luckily if they worked with me, it took time. I never lied and said, yeah, we'll do it in a month because even from 2018 to fast forward to the back end of 2019 when Reels came. It was already slowing down because of the amount of users on the platform and how they were distributing it. But if you could build an audience to 10 ,000 people, which is a lot of people, if you imagine you stood on the stage, that's a lot in a targeted way, then your chances of converting, if you even just to say 10%, you'd have converted a thousand people. Now, if you imagine now you're in the same mindset, but we're now looking at Reels, Reels is already just an organic. platform and I know that I'm calling it a separate platform because it is with Instagram. They've put the two together now. That Reels is there to get your new audience. But if you get a new audience and say your reel pops off, you get a hundred thousand views, just for example, and you start seeing these likes and these new followers. If they're not your new follower and I know you wouldn't like to do it, remove them off because the problem that you're going to have is you're building the wrong audience. So you might get to that 10 ,000. But when it comes to you doing a launch, I don't want anyone to feel here that they're going to feel deflated. It's like, I've got 10 ,000 followers and like one person bought my product. How is that possible? And it's because now if you get a viral reel that goes out to the masses, it means that it's just gone out to everyone because they just feel that like, it's done well. Whatever you've done, let's just show it to everyone for them to get their user activity up to try and get back to the number one spot. Instagram itself is a selfish being, if we want to call it a person. They just want people to stay on their platforms. They're number one again, because they're not. It is still TikTok that's number one. So for you, if you are a person at the moment that's feeling about, let's get viral. I want all these views. I want to look good. We need to shift that mindset to more, actually, I'd rather get four or 5 ,000 views on a reel that is all in the property niche. that as it's growing quite slowly, you might get 30 followers, you might get 50, but the chances are, those 30, 50 followers, you may actually get more of a conversion that's going to top up your bank balance. Now, I don't know about you, Athena, I know which one I'd prefer. Do I want loads of views and loads of followers or do I want to be making money in my bank every month? Yeah, this is something I had to learn as well. You I had to get rid of the whole vanity matrix of everything. And actually, you know, you might have 30 likes or 40 likes on something, but actually one of those then messages you and you convert it to a lead. So, you know, that means so much more than 500 likes, you know. Yeah, and don't forget that is a that is an awful thing, the vanity, because I'm not going to sit here and say it doesn't affect me if I spent three hours making a reel and I've my heart and soul into it and it goes on and it flatlines. And do you know what? Again, reels, it's Russian roulette. I'm not joking. I've done loads and loads of strategy on this. I know ways to help give you a boost, but it's never guaranteed. It might pop off. It might not. Telling you now, ladies are watching the ones I spent three hours editing. never do well. The one that I've just walked down the street and said something motivational because I've last minute panicked and been like, I need to put something on. It's gone on, it's done the best. And every single time, that's what happens to me, that you spend all this time editing, but the ones that you actually don't care about just pop off. And I think that's something that we need to try and normalise in the social space that there is a vanity. I'm glad they've got the likes, you can turn them off now. I started just turning mine off all the time because I think we don't need to base ourselves on likes, people don't need to know the likes. And I think it's a good mental health way of people not getting too focused. And I'll be honest, some of them, I might get like 700 likes on one and the next time I'll get 15. So, you you can't really judge your success on a number. You've really got to grit through it and think, actually, I'm making money. That's the goal. And I'm already at the 17 % disadvantage being a female business owner against a viral content creator. So it's looking at the perspective of it and understanding you're in a different league in a different game that actually, if you stick on your path and ignore all the annoying things in the space, you will start to succeed. I love that. And then my final bit that I just want to ask you about, because we need to do like a part two on this Sarah. There's just so much golden information, but I'm happy to admit that I'm probably better at Instagram than I am at Facebook. And when I say better, what I mean by that is I actually post the same content on Instagram that I post on Facebook, but my audience and my reach does far better on Instagram than it does on Facebook to the point where I'm even like, ugh. Facebook? Do I even want to post on this? So what's your opinion about Facebook and how to get the most out of it? you know what Facebook is a tricky one. I loved Facebook. Like I said, way back in the day when I started, in fact, I've had a Facebook since like 2010, you know, like when you used to put all of your pictures up and make albums, they're still there. Like we've all been there with our little Nikon cameras, but from a business perspective, it's tricky. I'm not a Facebook business page person. I don't really feel that they give you the reach. And the reason why is because Facebook business pages are built for ads. So whereas I'm an organic strategist to help people leverage the features that are available, the Facebook business page, they'll start to give you a bit of reach like, there's a bit of hope everyone, we've given you some views. And then the next time it will flatline, because now they're like, right, we want you to pay. And the worst thing you can do, just as a side note on top of this conversation is, please never boost your posts. The reason why is if you're going to want to pay money, go straight to ads, a boost. gives them a bit of money, but the fact that they know you've paid that little bit of money, they'll expect it every time. So they'll keep your reach low to keep you boosting it after that. And that's the same for Instagram. But with Facebook, what I love from a business side is the community element. It takes a bit of time now when it comes to create a group and get the audience in there. And I went through this with you, didn't I, Athena? If you actually leverage what the group side of Facebook is. have a look at where the property groups are, different things, start to get yourself in there, that you're able to then build your own community. It then becomes what I call a little hub, and you'll start to get an audience that starts to ask more questions than what they do on Instagram. But in terms of both of the platforms, I still do use Facebook, even though the reach has got less over the years, just because I'm used to it and I like it. But in terms of business, Instagram's still the more profitable side. just because it's got that credibility factor. People now, and we all know this, if someone says, I want to see this property coach Athena, they're gonna check your Instagram before they check your Facebook because it opens to the public. The minute you hear anything, you won't go on like Google, you won't go on like Yale or whatever. The first thing anyone does when they hear a name is, I'm gonna see what their Instagram is. And that's what this is credibility, which is why the focus should be more on Instagram and with what you're doing Athena is, repurposing the content onto your Facebook and just having that little bit of activity. That's exactly what I'm doing. My main thing is Instagram and then I repurpose it onto Facebook. That's exactly right. And you're right, actually, one thing I haven't been doing enough of is actually getting into different Facebook groups and adding value to those groups. So rather than going into a Facebook group and just being like, hi, this is what I do. Here's how I sell something. Actually, somebody might ask a question and you can even search rent to rent or HMOs or whatever your field might be. And then they might say, does anybody know you know, how to put like an inventory together for rent in an appropriate way. And you could maybe respond and say, did this question already get answered? If not, here's my top tips. And just keep doing that over and over again and almost diary yourself to do it. Yeah, and it doesn't take too long. Like I say to a lot of my clients and everyone else, you don't have to spend hours a day engaging, like as long as you just apply like 15 minutes or an annoying rule that I've done to some of my clients, which has took them off social media. Cause let's not forget, I always talk about the psychology of how things have changed that we're now in a habit of when you go on, it's called a scroll. Like you'll just sit there and scroll, whereas that wasn't a thing five years ago. Now we just scroll and that's obviously impacted engagement because I'll hold my hands up myself. I will engage sometimes if I'm stuck in the scroll, I'm just like, like consuming content. I'm not connecting with it. I'm just consuming it. And there is a big difference between connecting with content and consuming it. So I think when it comes to looking at Facebook and Instagram as the metrics and not forgetting as well. Sorry, I know I'm going in between things here. I just didn't want to forget to say, Athena, Facebook's also a different demographic. Like none of my nieces even have a Facebook account. So it depends for you as a business owner property. I mean, Athena, you may have some ladies here that are in their twenties. They may not have a Facebook account like my nieces don't. So it depends on if your ideal client, like your client avatar is in their thirties, forties, fifties. then yeah, you will find a few on Facebook because that's their platform. I've never integrated onto Instagram, but if you're looking for a younger generation, I know with property could be a bit difficult, but some of them have the money to invest Athena, know, people start young, you just don't know what's happened. They will definitely be looking on Instagram and YouTube. So it's, it's kind of like working out what you feel comfortable with and more importantly, which platforms you like Athena, you like Instagram more. So you're more passionate about showing up. Some people, if you prefer Facebook, you'll be more passionate and show up more there. It's just understanding how to navigate it organically. If you're not at a stage to invest in ads, how you can make it work for you. But anyone before ads, again, I will say this because it's important. If your platform doesn't know who you are and who you're trying to attract, then even your ads will fail. You have to make sure that you've understood how to program it all for it to work in your favor. Yeah, I love that. Would you, I, do you know what I would love at the end of the year, if you're up for it, for you to come back on and talk about Facebook ads. Cause I think that would be a really, really good podcast to have as well. Cause lots of people say, should I be paying for ads? And to be honest with you, I don't really understand it in a greater detail. I still need to learn all about ads because all my growth has always been organic. And so I think we should get you back on after California to come and talk all about Facebook ads. Cause I think that would be a good conversation. Yeah, and I think it depends if it works, people. I mean, don't get me wrong, pay to play, you're going to get more reach if you do it correctly. I've done ads for clients myself. I've never ever run ads for my business, just like, know, because it completely goes against my organic methods. So for my business, I've never ever run ads because it goes against the integrity of being an organic strategist to get results, because then you would know that I've grown it through ads. But some of my clients that have worked with me, they've got to a stage, they've got to a launch and they've said, Sarah, I need a fast track. How can we do this? And that is where you would then have to do ads because it takes the pressure off instead of you having to get loads of leads. And you'll know this, Athena, there's loads of extensions now, which is like Elm, many chat. I can't remember the other one now when we knew spoke about Athena. I you don't use it because I don't use it, but all these integrations now that if you run an ad, it's like a chat bottle respond to it for you. So there's so many different ways in how we can also automate and streamline our businesses. depending on the time, but I'm still a person on, like it to be me. I like it to speak to me. I think it's more real, even though, and I haven't gone to the latest things, which we'll quickly get to Athena with AI, I think we're gonna be looking at a very different Instagram, Facebook, WhatsApp next year. I did comment on Mark Zuckerberg's, if that's how you pronounce his last name, I've never been able to say it properly. It keeps doing a reel. And I don't know if your audience, my audience is mainly the US, believe it or not, from when I was traveling the world. I've kind of gone more down that avenue. But obviously being from the UK, what I struggle with is the rest of the world has the new AI tools and we don't yet. We was meant to get Instagram AI on the 26th of June, 2024. It's now August. In fact, it's September in less than a week. The UK still don't have it. And again, going back to TikTok, know, I can go on a rumble here. This is the problem. The UK, because we're so small yet so powerful in terms of the internet, we're such a small little group that we get everything last. Don't ask me why. So any updates, the UK and Europe, and usually Europe get it before us, are always last. So the rest of the world currently, and if you have the AI, please let us know in the comments, but I've asked this out to... many people, they don't have it. We should have it now. That integration is a completely different level and a layer into our current Instagram app. So where you've got your search bar at the top, it actually now will be, and I'm sure Mark said it's going to be Llama 3. I don't know if anyone's looking at AI programs like I am. So I've looked at the different ones. He's got into like a collaboration with Llama 3 AI production. that actually it will do everything for you. So you know where is the minute I'm having to ask you to do the layouts and change things to make sure that the app understands. The minute the AI is on there, you won't actually necessarily have to do that because it will take what you're searching and actually show you suggestions. It'll even message people. It'll sound like you. It's really like another avatar of you within the app. And it changes it on your stories as well. But we don't have it yet. We should have it, but we don't. And it's the same with Facebook, that even introducing your AI assistant, if anyone does have a group, you'll already see that it's in groups. It says AI assist. I've not used it yet, but it is there. But as it evolves even more, I think we're all going to have like AI editing, because that's coming for your images. So you can do it within the app. AI systems to where you can search things, AI messaging. And I think that's because obviously it's not partnered with chat GPT. that is found another way. So that's one of the big things I can share that we are going to have. But again, you'll have to learn to understand how it works to get the best organic reach out of it. I really hope that that's in by the time we go to California so that when you do your chat you can teach us all about it. That'd be so cool. fingers crossed. It is in the workbook. So it is in there. I've got all the pictures and stuff. I've had to ask my American clients, can you send me this? Can you send me that? Because I don't have it. So I'm like, but I can educate myself on it. There's a lot of different things, or you can learn it before it comes. But I like to play with things. I like to figure it out so that I can really go through it. So at the minute when I do my one -to -one with some of my Americans. I have them sharing the screen and I'm like, right, just press that button for me. Just do this, just do that. And then like, I've just learned something, you know, Sarah. And I'm like, well, we're learning together currently because this is the only way I can learn it right now. So we'll just play around with it. I love it. And you know what my advice would be to anyone listening to this as well, because this has just proven it, is try and like surround yourself with as many people as you possibly can. Because Sarah, we met through Rebecca Barr, because I obviously signed up to the Wealthy Woman kind of mastermind where I now meet lots of different women in business doing lots of amazing different things. And of course, you're doing your thing, I'm doing mine, others are doing theirs. And what I would recommend to everyone is just get out there and meet people because you learn so much from others as well. And you get to just be inspired by what other people do and learn about top tips. Like, you know, speaking to people about gut health or I'm now back in the gym and so getting gym tips and it's just great. And so I recommend to everyone just expand your horizons outside of your current circle because like we talked about with our celebration, you know, it's all part of evolution of ourselves and really recognizing who it is we want to be and how we're to evolve with that. yeah, I've just learned so much from you as well and continue to do. And I hope everyone's loved this podcast. I feel like we could go on for hours and hours. And like I said, part two, we've got to do a part two, 100%. Just before we actually finish off this podcast, Sarah, I don't know if you know this, but how the podcast usually finishes, is we always talk about like a property disaster. And this could actually be like a personal thing that happened to you. Maybe it could be like something that happened in Bali or in, you know, in Greece or wherever, or it could be if you've ever invested in property. But have you got like a bit of a funny mishap disaster story at all? do actually, and it is related to property in the UK. My partner, as me and Athena have in common, we've got like little surf rad dudes or whatever they wanna be. He actually bought a property last year and was getting into the property renovation. It was a flip, so he wasn't doing anything with it. He just wanted to flip it and sell it. He's a tradesman anyway, so it should have been an easy job. Anyway, he bought a house that had, you walked in and the... boiler had obviously I think it had been abandoned for about three years so it didn't actually have a ceiling and it all like flooded the whole house so we had to check like the arch and I don't know what they're called but you know the wooden see the wood hadn't rotted there you go there's my terminology check it was all okay anyway he got it at such a such a low investment really because I don't know if anyone's been to Beverly it's in the north it's nowhere near as expensive as London or down south but in this area on average properties are between 300 ,000, 600 ,000. And he got this property for only 120 ,000 because of the work it needed to get done. Well, anyway, they were kind of like dragging it on and on and he actually ended up backing out of it. Even though he's prepared to do the work, they wouldn't sign off that the sewage was okay. So it was a bit like, if there's something wrong with the sewage, I'm already fixing a roof, a boiler. even the solar panels that they had no records for. So we didn't actually know if the house owned the solar panels or not. And then when it came to like the sewage, he was like, yeah, I don't think I'll be taking that on. If there's something wrong with the sewage and the pipes, that's not an easy quick flip job. So yeah, he actually ended up backing out of it and he's really happy because we drive past it most days. don't usually know this. This is very not my area of expertise. But even though scaffolding costs quite a lot of money to have up, doesn't it? Well, they've had... The scaffolding's been up for nearly two months. So I can imagine that's probably cost them quite a bit of money. They've taken the solar panels off, so we're guessing that they probably weren't owned. And I think we've found out from someone, obviously it's small area, that it was infested with rats. Do you know what? This is why you've got to do all your checks and just because something is cheap, be careful. It's cheap for a reason. I mean, I'm obsessed with Homes Under the Hammer, I'm not going to lie. So we definitely went and had a look at it. We went round and we viewed it. But when it came to everything else, you can see this isn't my expertise, but yeah, it had no roof, it had nothing, sewage sign off, solar panels. Even though we could have done it, I think it probably would have not bankrupted. the money that we had taken to get it there, I think it would have been Whereas he wanted to flip it in about six to eight months, I think it had taken much longer. that sounds like a bigger job than that. That really does. God. And you know what? That's really good that he recognized the fact that you don't always have to take it on just because you view it and you don't need to rush it. If it is, you know, don't get shiny penny syndrome going, yeah, but we could make this much money. It's like, yeah, but a lot could go wrong. And then you're stuck with a house that you don't want. So. when people ask your opinion and this applies in my business, probably your business, Athena, and when he asked what my opinion was, I was like, honestly, what does your gut say? And he said, no, said, with your gut. Your gut never lies. And I've found that throughout my whole life that if I have a bad feeling and my gut is like, this isn't right, I'll listen to it now. Because there's been times where you haven't and you've realized I should have listened to it. Yeah, yeah, that happens to me still all the time and sometimes I still, if I'm honest, I still sometimes ignore my gap and then I go, man, here we go again, should have listened. Worked out well for me though, Athena, because I'm trying to convince him now to move to Portugal next year. We'd have been doing the house, so I'm now like, yeah, let's just go live in Portugal now. Let's just do this. We'll find something else. I like to, I'm sure a lot of you are that are watching, so I want to be that person that inspires you with this. I do have like my social media business, but I'm always looking at other things as well. You know, things I can have on the side. because you just don't ever know which way things are going to turn out. And I do believe in my stepping stones in life. And some of you may agree with this, that like any past relationships I've been in or anything I've done at work, it's all contributed to where I am today. it's like, so like the fact that I've learned so much about social media, I understand how to make it work. I could apply that to anything that now I'm thinking, yeah, maybe we should set up like a completely different business, but use social media and see how that goes. And then you just don't know where that will lead either. So I like to trial and error things. That's my motto in life and just see if it works, it works. If it doesn't, it doesn't. I tried. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. you don't have to just be the same person for five, 10 years. It's like when people say to me all the time, they're like, less so much now actually. But before they say, you've changed. I'm like, yeah, I know, it's great. I'll change again. different conversation in part two about that. I can tell you loads of stories about different people that I'm thinking, yeah, have changed. Like we all do this. If anyone is still on Facebook from 10 years ago, do you ever get a status that you wrote and thought, who wrote that? And you can see it yourself. And you read it and you think, my God, that's the most embarrassing thing ever. And it just wrote. Yeah, it is. You laugh at yourself, but you think, there's no way I would post that now. No, I love that. put on my Facebook for some people, like my friend Rachel in the past, like, hi Rachel, give me a call. I'd like text her over Facebook to say, call me. And we have so many different things now. But yeah, in terms of self -development and where we've come and how we've grown, that's a really good point to talk about next time as well. Because sometimes you actually outgrow people and that's OK. Some people really struggle with that and think that they're a bad person because they no longer have the time. It's not that you don't have the time. I like to you've just gone down different paths. You're still friends, you still like each other. It's just a different path. Completely agree. We will talk about that in the next in the next pod that we'll do at the end of the year. We'll do Facebook ads and we'll talk about change because I think it's so important. then if people wanted to find you, which I'm sure they are going to want to do off the back of this podcast and get loads of more tips and advice from you, where is the best place for people to find you? Yeah, probably go to my Instagram account for the travel one though. So I'll only give you one cause I do link them in the stories cause Athena, that's where all the LA stuff will go. So if we go to Sarah Smile Scott, it's got an extra T on the end for my Instagram. And then if you do want to join my free Facebook group, which has all the lives and different updates that I do bring tend to be weekly by weekly. That's actually called social media moneymakers. And you're more than welcome to come over and join the fun there. And that also has a link to the free accountability group. If you're a person that wants someone to check in on you every day for posting, that's in the featured within that group and you're more than welcome to join. Yeah. Yeah. on, let's do this. And then if you want to find me, I'm Athena Dobson at underscore official on Instagram. I'm also girls and property. Of course, if you want to email girls and property pod at gmail .com. And then what I will say is just keep your ears close to the ground. There are some really exciting things coming for girls and property. Of course, if you want to join the girls and property community. We always have on the first Tuesday of every single month, we have a guest expert speaker on the community group talking about something to do within your business. So on Tuesday, the third of September, we're going to have Alice Darnall talking all about energy and time management, which is really, really important as well. So come and join the community. Just DM me the word community if you want to join. And I've also got tickets left to the Christmas gala on Saturday, the 7th of December. So come to the Christmas party, which is great. Got some updates coming for that one. And then finally, if you did want a bit more help just to get into the property, get your mindset in the right place, DM me the word mindset and I'll send you across my free course to that one as well. But Sarah, we're going off to LA in a couple of weeks, which is exciting. So we'll be documenting and showing everyone our fun times. Yeah, yeah, why not? can't wait. I'm really excited for it actually. I'm very organized. I'm always organized anyway, but I'm more organized this time around for going over to events and speaking. But yeah, think you're going to love it. You're going to love the workbook, Athena. I focus, spoiler alert for anyone, because I know some people may not be coming and watching. I've done it on specifically reels for business. So it's a full strip down of how we make it work. Perfect, okay. And fingers crossed for sunshine. Sunshine! But thank you so much for coming on today. I appreciate it's a bank holiday as well. So I really appreciate your time. You gave it a wealth, wealth of knowledge. I've learned all about hashtags. I'm gonna be changing that immediately. And yeah, will see you, I'll see you at the airport. I'll see you there. Thanks Sarah, see you later. Have a great week everyone. Speak to you soon. Bye.