From Invisible to Visible: Attracting Your Ideal Clients and Generating Leads on LinkedIn with Rochelle Gilburn

We’re back with another exciting episode you won’t want to miss! Join your host Athena as she chats with the incredible Rochelle Gilburn, a savvy property investor making waves in the industry.

In this episode of Girls in Property, Rochelle shares how she leverages LinkedIn to connect with her ideal clients and generate valuable leads. She also opens up about her powerful journey of overcoming personal loss, which ignited her quest for purpose and a brighter future for her family.

With her extensive experience in property investing and LinkedIn, Rochelle is here to empower you with tips on getting visible and attracting your own investors.

Get ready for an inspiring and fun episode that will leave you motivated. 

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Transcript

0:01

Good morning everyone and welcome to today's episode of the Girls in Property podcast. On today's episode, I have somebody awesome I'd love to introduce you to. Not only is she in the property industry, supporting other women's communities as well, but she's also absolutely fabulous and teaches us all about how to use LinkedIn effectively as well, which is what the topic of today is gonna be all about, which I'm super excited about, as more of you are actually beginning to use it in a more effective way now to find your investors. So without further ado, I'd love to introduce you to Rochelle Gilburn. Hi, Rochelle. Thank you for inviting me on. I'm excited to be on the podcast. Yay! And I love the fact that today we talk about property and we can talk about, you know, the more holistic view of kind of LinkedIn, how to use it effectively. Because so many people are getting on it now. Like I used to think it was just once upon a time like this, it was for businesses or the corporate life or even dare I say like older generations. And it's sort of coming back into it now, isn't it? Yeah, definitely. Absolutely. I used to use it just as my online CV in a past life. And then when I started in property, I started using LinkedIn straight away. And then it's been brilliant for my property business. So now I'm showing other people, property people, how they can use it in their business as well. I love that, I love that. wait for that in today's episode. Before we sort of delve straight into that, can you first of all please tell people about you, sort of your background, how you actually came into now from Property Now, teach how to use LinkedIn? Like how did it all come together? Yeah, so a bit about me. I'm living on the outskirts of Sheffield, South Yorkshire. So I think I'm quite far away from you. Are you down south somewhere? I am, I'm all the way in Bournemouth. yeah, so we're about four hours away. drove to Bournemouth a few times. I started in property at the beginning of 2020. I went on a property course in January, came out, set up a website, set up loads of leafleting marketing for my property sourcing business and then obviously went into lockdown the beginning of March or middle of March time. So I just spent all this money investing in my property education and then all of a sudden I couldn't do anything. couldn't go out on viewings, I've not got any projects up and running or anything like that yet. But the one thing I had done as soon as I finished my property course, I started posting on LinkedIn. And that year I made a commitment to myself that I was going to post every single day, no matter what. So during lockdown, I've got my two kids who were, old had they been? Three and five, I think, at the time. And I was a single parent, so it was... I wasn't getting up to very much apart from homeschooling and taking care of them. So I had to really think out of the box of like what to post about and how to generate interest. it just grew and and grew. So then when I came out of lockdown, I actually started doing property. I got my first property to renovate at the beginning of January, 2021. And that was a flip that I did for myself. And in the meantime, I'd signed up a couple of investors to my property sourcing business. And I did 12 in my first year, 12 renovations. And then I've just kept going since then. I still focus on the property sourcing business, but I've been building my own portfolio. I've got a couple of service accommodation properties as well. And then in October 2022, I decided to do a public speaking course. and I knew I wanted to speak on stage. was something I'd enjoyed doing from like at school. I was always the first person to put my hand up and assemble it to get up and read something out. So I did this course and I thought nobody wants to hear about vitalettes because that's what I saw. So I was pretty boring. The only people I know who run networking events are property people. So I don't want to go to a property event and speak about vitalettes. So what else am I good at? and I knew I was quite good at LinkedIn so I thought right I'll put together a presentation about that. So I did my first one last year in March and now I speak at an event at least once a month this month I've got two and a couple of online things as well. And then it starts to get expensive traveling around speaking at events so I I better start looking at how I can monetize this and I realized that there's a real gap in the in the market for property people and LinkedIn training. So I set up a Facebook group and put out a PDF and just started doing like one -to -one workshops teaching people how to do LinkedIn. it's the more I put out about that, the more I got invited on to do podcasts and to speak at events. So it's, it's worked in my favor. And I'd say the property can be quite stressful and it's very time consuming. The LinkedIn is more of a a passion project that I absolutely love. absolutely adore that. And I love how you were so creative and thinking, well, well, how could I be different when I speak? What is it that other people are not speaking about and you thought differently? Like, I love that. Rochelle, I'm just going to go back on based on what you just said, because I love it. And I think that the listeners will really relate to it as well, which is the fact that you are a single mum of two children. I speak to a lot of mums with young children at this moment in time, specifically single mums. How did you feel taking that, if you like that risk when you first started taking on all these properties, which, know, when you first start, you don't really know if it's going to work, if it's not going to work, and then having the responsibility of having those children, how did you kind of overcome that fear in a way to get you there? so now I'm very lucky that I've got an amazing partner Chris and we've been together for three years. He's a joiner, which is amazing. I recommend if you're a single mum look for a joiner. Very handy when you've got a business. But yeah, it's fabulous in all ways. But yeah, when I started in property, so I'll tell you a bit about my background. My story is quite sad. In 2018, my husband passed away. He had a heart attack and left me as a single mum in a widow when my kids were just two and four. So I was in the fortunate position that he was like, it was really hard work. He was always saving and thinking about retirement and putting money away. So I was left financially stable, but obviously it was very difficult situation going from having someone there to support you physically and mentally to then being. being on my own and the first year was quite chaotic in that I was finding myself again and I was going out too much and drinking too much and not being, just trying to like forget about life, life in general basically and towards the end of 2019 I started to think I can't really live my life this way, I need to start doing something. with it and one of my friends at the time was doing property sourcing and I started speaking to her about potentially building my own portfolio and then the more I spoke to her, my background was in marketing and the more I was speaking to her, the more I thought a lot of what you're describing to me, yeah, not that I don't know anything about the property stuff, but the stuff that you're promoting and like I know how to do that so maybe this is something I can look into. So that's when I did the property course and it really like lit a fire back in me and motivated me to want to do more and opened the doors to like what's possible. But yeah, I definitely found it difficult. So many of my friends who were in property were doing it either as a couple or they were business partners or they were doing it on their own but they've got a really supportive husband at home that allowed them the freedom. So I was trying to juggle everything and I think I found it quite frustrating because I feel like I've not been moving as quickly as so many other people. But at the same time, because of what happened with my husband, I know how short life is and I want to make the most of time with the kids. So while other people might be working all hours under the sun, I've tried to restrict it so that I am working during the school days and I'm not traveling too much. That's why I've tried to restrict the public speaking to once a month rather than being away all the time. So it's just been trying, it definitely is difficult to get that balance and make sure that I'm showing my children that anything is possible and we need to chase our dreams but also being there to support them and be a good mum. Yeah, absolutely. I'm so sorry to hear that about your husband as well. Like that's, that's absolutely dreadful. And yeah, it's so, it's so amazing when I speak to so many mums, I'm not a mum myself, but I have so much respect. I really do, because it's so difficult to get the right balance between, you know, do you risk it? Do you risk the money that is technically there to support you and your family, but to make a better life? Or do you not take the risk? and just carry on doing what you're doing because you then create the safety net for then your family and your children because you don't quite know. And I think that's such a tough balance it really is. And when I speak to so many people, everyone is very different in terms of how they view this. So yeah, I just want to encourage more women like yourself to really have belief in themselves and really go for it. I think that's what I really want to champion. So you're a great advocate for that. Absolutely brilliant. often like it when I when I think about like what I've done and what I've achieved I think financially I was probably much more stable before I started in property and started business but it's been a huge learning curve and I think the things that I've learned over the over the last four years like I'd have never been able to to learn like I'd never be where I am now if I'd not taken those risks and I'm 35 now and I I see people who are in their 50s and they're doing amazing things and they've been in property for years and years. And I know that at some point that'll be me, that other people will be thinking, when I'm that age, I want to be there. I want to have accomplished all these different things. It feels like I'm still young, only just getting started. There's a lot more to come from me. And I think I've been... At the same time as learning how to run a business, learning how to do property, learning how to be a mom, I've also been dealing with the grief of losing my husband and I'm the type of person that I often bottle a lot of stuff up and push down those feelings and that does have an impact on my performance and it's making sure that I keep on top of things and help provide a good service to my clients but also look after my... my mental health and take time away when I need it. 100 % totally agree. And then speaking about sort of your life now and where you are in the chapter as it were, what would you say that you were celebrating at this moment in your life? What am I celebrating? So one of the things, I spoke at a Progressive Property Network event last week in Leeds and three years ago I went to the exact same event and I can remember there were like 60 people in the audience and the guy who runs it asked who wanted to introduce themselves, just stand up for 30 seconds, tell us who you are, where you're from, like what you do. and I wanted to do it desperately but I could feel my heart was like racing and racing and everyone else was doing it. I'm like, come on, Rochelle, you can do it, you can do it. And I'm like forcing myself to put my hand up and I was the last person to put my hand up and stand and do it. And I can remember my voice shaking and just being so full of nerves. So then three years later to be invited back. to stand on that stage where I was so nervous three years ago and be able to deliver a 45 minute presentation to everyone just felt amazing and that really showed how I've progressed over the years. So I think that's what I'm celebrating at the moment. go on girl that's so brilliant yes that's like the best celebration ever you're like went from 30 seconds to 45 minutes I love that It was so funny because I saw other people in the room who were in that same position as me terrified to stand up and speak and I said to them and it explained like how I'd been there and like you will if you want to do it you will get there it's just pushing yourself out of your comfort zone just a little bit of a little bit of time and and growing and now I don't really get any nerves when I speak on stage at all. I've done it so many times. I know what I'm saying. I know what I'm talking about. I think the next thing will be when I've got a completely brand new presentation to deliver. I might get a little bit nervous then, but that's the next step I need to start thinking about what presentation we're going to deliver next. You know what the beauty of it is though? No one has seen your presentation. Nobody knows it. That's why I always say to myself, a majority of the time I wing it anyway. And so I'm like, well, no one's seen it before. So I'll just mix it up and I'll just ask a bunch of questions and take, take the focus off of me. So yeah, I love that. I love what a great celebration. And then what I'm celebrating at the moment, which some people have seen if they're following me on social media and in the Girls and Property community group, but Girls and Property officially received its trademark. this month, which is super exciting, super exciting, because now the sky's the limit effectively and beyond. And I've announced, which is really exciting, that I want to start to launch 10 locations now across the UK for girls and property, which is amazing, because for me, it's all about accessibility. It's like, well, the ladies in the north near up to where you are, Rochelle, it's like, well, do they have to travel all the way down south every time? Or can we do more in the north? Can we do more in the Midlands? we be. So I said I'd start off with 10 locations and I've got potentially 10 women lined up to host in their areas. in what capacity we're still, thank you, in what capacity we're still getting to grips with and my thing about Girls and Property is this is not a dictatorship, this is collaboration. So I don't want to tell the girls how I see it, I want to ask them what they think would work and so there's lots of conversations that need to be had in order to do that. but the conversations are definitely happening. And I'm just so excited to give these women like a voice and a platform that they can then show themselves to be credible in their area with their services and expand beyond that. So it's super exciting. We're 70 members now in the community group, growing fast. We've got the gala coming up. it's expansion is what I'm celebrating. Like, you know, for women, as we say, let's just get all women. you know, in every, every community that exists, just really, really pushing forward. So yay. So that's great. Thank you. Thank you. Right. Let's get to the crux of today's podcast, which is all about LinkedIn. And quite frankly, Rishal, I need, I need to learn. I need to learn. Definitely. I do post, I do post as often as I can. And quite frankly, it's usually repurposed material from Instagram and Facebook. So let's start with the basics then. So. Hmm. Try to think of a good question, good questions to start with. So with LinkedIn, say that I want, so first of all, no, let's start right at the beginning. Why would a person post on LinkedIn? Like a property person? For what purpose should we be posting on LinkedIn? Let's start there. So the way that I see LinkedIn is like when you go to a networking event, everybody is there to network, do business, get to know each other. And that's the purpose of LinkedIn. Whereas other social media platforms, you can do business on there and people do. And I use Facebook to promote the LinkedIn aspect of my business. But Facebook people are much more likely to be there to relax, see photos of the friends and the family and the kids and just socialize. So they're not. They're not in an open mind to being sold to or to buying, whereas LinkedIn's much more, that's its intention. And when LinkedIn first started and it was just an online CV and people still see it as that, but actually it's so much more. Now it is a social network, just more with the business aspect of it. And some of the things that I love about it is that you can search for people based on the specific location, the job title, the industry that they're working. So if you know who your ideal client is, so for me, I use it for my property source in business. My ideal client lives in the south of England. They're usually a director of a company. So I'm using LinkedIn to search for directors in London, and I'm connecting with them. Whereas on Facebook and Instagram, it's very difficult to find out what people's jobs are and sort of assess whether they're likely to have any sort of money that they're going to be able to invest in property. So it's all about sort of narrowing it down and deciding who is it that's likely to have this pot of money that hasn't got the time to invest in property themselves that might want to use my service. And then the other thing I love about it is it's really easy to reach other people's connections. So if I like your post, the people who are connected to me are going to see that post. And then if they like it, their connections will see it. So it's much easier to grow and be seen by more people than it is on things like Facebook and Instagram. That's so interesting. let's say that I wanted to search for females in property or females in business. Do I literally just put that into the search bar then on LinkedIn? I don't think you can search by gender but you can definitely search for property or if you want to look for property sources or specific estate agents or anything like that and then you're looking specifically in your area of Bournemouth to come to that networking event then you can select the location that they're in as well and then all the people will come up and then obviously usually by the photos and things you can filter out whether they're female or male. That's great. I really love that. And I understand the social aspect of it. You make a really good point about the difference between Facebook and Instagram and LinkedIn and what people are there, how they're consuming information. You you do marketing, I do marketing. It's all about consumer behavior and what their intended purpose is there. So I completely understand that. What would you say like through your experience were your more successful posts on LinkedIn? they have a particular format were they mainly images was it was it long format short format like what would you deem to be successful posting Yeah, so the best post for me are usually when there's a photo and a medium length block of text. Just text used to work really well on LinkedIn. It used to be all text based and then that started not working so well. But some people do build up a successful profile just text based. Video hasn't tended to work very well in the past, but LinkedIn have made some changes recently that They're bringing in more of a reels type thing. So they're promoting videos at the moment. So if you like creating video content or if you've already got it, then it might be worth giving it try and see how it performs. But like anything in marketing, it's trial and error, seeing what works for you, seeing what it is that you like doing. Like if you hate writing, but you love recording videos, even though videos might not perform as good as writing, you're more likely to produce the content that you're that you need. So it's all about being consistent with it. So that's why. So in my first year on LinkedIn, when I first started in the January, I had 250 connections. By the end of it, I'd got 15 ,000. And that was through the consistency of posting every day, connecting with up to 15 people a day, and just building up that consistency. But the funny thing is that some of my best performing posts are literally the throwaway comments that have taken me a few, like, 30 seconds, a few minutes to write and people spend an hour crafting the perfect post and thinking, right, this one's going to go viral, this one's going to be amazing. And they often flop. The ones that you don't put much effort into tend to be the ones that do the best. And some people, because it's LinkedIn and they see LinkedIn as being more formal, and I've had lots of people say things like, one woman said, I feel like I'm not posh enough to be on LinkedIn. And you can just show up on LinkedIn and be yourself. I often, you know, I wear hoodies, I'll share a selfie with my hoodie on. I'm not like, I don't have a full face of makeup and my suit and heels or anything like that, because that's not who I am. So you want to paint that true picture of yourself so that when people do contact you to do business, they know who they're getting. They're not getting some, some false person. But some of the, some of the best performing posts I've had won. was about, I mentioned Chris, my partner, who's a joiner. He was renovating our own house and he was plastering the wall. And I took a photo of him plastering and I said that Chris was busy plastering the house today while I'm taking photos for social media. Like, how are you spending your weekend? Just something like that. It was such a short post. It reached about 30 ,000 people and people were commenting on it telling me that or they were, I think that was it. I led with the headline, my top dating tip, get yourself a joiner, something like that. So people were telling me, my partner's a joiner, or my partner's really handy, wish my partner was handy, wish I was handy. Just getting involved and telling me their opinion and they're the person that tends to do well. They're not necessarily business related, but it's giving people a chance to tell you something about. them or voice their opinion. And if you can split that opinion as well, then that works well because people start debating amongst themselves in the comments. I don't tend to like to be controversial, but if you are happy to be controversial, that can really divide opinions and get posts going. I like that. I'm going to come back to this in one second because I've got some questions about that. But before I do, I'm just trying to think like, say a person isn't on LinkedIn and they're like, right, okay, I'll listen to the Girls and Property podcast with Rochelle and I'll get on LinkedIn. So let's say they're brand new to LinkedIn. In terms of the layout, it's quite a structured layout, isn't it? You know, they even make you put like your education in your previous experience all of that which is nothing like Facebook or Instagram So what would you say like would be your top tips in terms of? What to put on your LinkedIn for your bio and how to structure it. What would be your tips there? So, your bio is really important because like I said, that post about Chris was nothing to do with my business. I wasn't doing a sales tip or anything like that. And I've had it before where I've put really casual posts that have done really well. But the good thing about it is people then underneath your name, you have what it is that you do. So I make sure I put who I help and how I can help them. So mine says something like, I help. seven figure business owners reinvest their profit into property using very little of their own time, something like that. And then a call to action message me with the word property to start the conversation. So that bit of information under your name is the thing that everybody sees every time you post this year, every time you comment on someone else's post, it shows up underneath your name. So that's the first thing on your profile. making sure people understand what it is that you do. And the same with your cover photo at the top, just something that's eye catching and says simply exactly what it is that you do for people. And then your about section is all about, a lot of people make it about them. So it's like, hi, I'm Rachelle Gilbert and I've been in property for four and a half years, blah, blah, blah. Where actually you want to set it up so you're telling them about what you can do for them. So it's listed like. saying what their problems might be. So you've always wanted to invest in property, but you just haven't got the time. You might not have the knowledge, whatever your points are for your ideal client, show them that you understand them and make them feel like you're talking directly to them. And then again, tell them how you can help them and then giving them a call to action. So said there, the two... most important parts, like nobody cares where you went to school or if you went to university or anything like that, they're looking at how you can help them. So interesting. think I'm going to go change my bio because you're, you're a hundred percent right. Cause a lot of people just talk about themselves and who they are and they might make it funny or they might make it witty kind of like a Tinder profile in a way. whereas actually you're right. It, the bio should probably be all about how, especially if you're trying to sell your services, let, let that, let that do it, do the work for you. So say how you can help somebody else. So I'm going to take that on board actually with Shannon and potentially change my bio to. to more of that, definitely. So thank you for that tip. That's really good. it's all, cause you're right, when people read other people's information, know, as selfish beings, as human beings, as we are, we want to know why should we listen to you? How can you help me? You know, so yeah. It is very selfish. People don't necessarily care about you. They care that your content is going to give them some value, that they're going to be entertained by it, or that you can offer them some sort of service that they might be interested in in the future. I like that. And you're so right. It's so sweet where people put their little GCSEs in their grades and everything, because LinkedIn does ask you for that. You don't have to put it in if you don't want to. But yeah, it's a really interesting format. And then I'm going to come back to this other question I was going to ask you about the post that you put out with your partner. So I speak to a lot of social media content providers, because I'm really interested in social media based on my personal marketing background. And there's this real controversial conversation happening, is around posts and going viral and how many likes and sort of the vanity metrics as opposed to actually in terms of monetization, what did you actually receive from the posts and the information that you're giving? So I speak to people where they're like, I would rather have 12 likes and two comments on a post, but actually get some business from it as opposed to having a hundred, like let's go for a thousand likes. 50 hobbits, whatever, and having no monetization from the post. So where do you sort of stand in terms of the vanity metrics and kind of how to use it effectively to actually convert to a sale? So the way that I see it is that there's some posts are just for each. It's just to get new people into the world. And the more new people you can reach, the more people know about you because if they don't know about you, then they can't do business with you. So if you can, if you can get posts going viral, like every time I get a post that's doing really well, which is not like it's, it's, So on average, my posts tend to reach two or 3 ,000 people, which is quite good, but I've got around 20 ,000 connections. But then every now and again, I'll do one that'll spike up to maybe 30 ,000. And when that happens... The amount of new people I get requesting connecting with me increases massively. I start getting loads of people connecting with me. I start getting loads of people viewing my profile because I've got my profile set up telling people what it is that I do. can see that there. So it brings lots of new people into my world. And then not every post is like that. Then other posts are giving them value and nurturing them. And those posts don't do as well. And then at the very bottom, you've got like your sales posts where they don't reach as many people. They don't get as much interaction, but they get people messaging you. So it's getting that balance between the three different types of posts. And what I tend to do is when I do a post that's doing really well, I'll then follow that straight up with a sales post. So when those people do click through to connect with me, they see my sales post straight away. And also when my when my last post has done really well, my next post tends to do quite well and it's sort of, it's going with that, that momentum. But when you're just starting out, like you're not going to reach massive amounts of people. And I think the first thing to do is start getting consistent. I do also think if you're not getting any likes or not getting many likes and comments, you need to look at your content and you need to be thinking about how can I make this more interesting? How can I make it more engaging? Because it's social media, you should be getting some. some likes and then engagement on your posts, especially if they're not sales posts. Definitely. Yeah. And that's the thing. It's such an interesting one with LinkedIn because you do see a lot of these pictures where you see a lot of people in suits and that type of thing. But people are still people at the end of the day. And a lot of people are watching. And then in terms of like, I'm just trying to think about like investors, for example. So the way I found investors is through social media, in lots of different ways. Facebook and Instagram I am better at than LinkedIn, to be honest with you. LinkedIn. is literally repurposing information. That's the only reason I post on LinkedIn effectively. So I might mix that up a little bit actually after this conversation with yourself. So if I was going to try and find, if I had a deal and I was trying to find investors and trying to attract investors, what key things would you say would be good to be posting about or be good in terms of finding the investors and attracting them through LinkedIn? How did you go about it? Yeah, so for me, when I first started talking about like, property on LinkedIn, often talked about, so for my investment area, our properties are really low prices. So we pay about 80 ,000 pounds for a three bed terraced house, spend around 25 ,000 refurbishing them. So it's like, it's low value. And that's one of the things that attracts people to me. That's one of my unique selling points. So for people who are looking to attract investors, working out like why, what's different about you, what's different about your area and like what have you got to offer them. When I first started and I was talking about you could get one property, you just needed 50 ,000 pounds to be able to invest. And I kept attracting a lot of people who they only had 50 ,000 or they might have 38 ,000 and is that enough? And I could work with that, but it was hard work and it meant that I was having to find more and more. investors so was having to have more more conversations to sign up the the next person and then I think it was probably end of last year I started talking about four properties with 200 000 and that really captured a different type of person's attention and all of a sudden the people who were contacting me were saying I have 200 000 each year or I've I've got I've got a pot of 200 ,000, I'm going to have another 100 ,000 next year. They just had more money, so it's about making sure you're that marketing message right, so that you're having the right conversations. And obviously with the FCA regulations and everything, it's difficult to not just go out and promote your deal as amazing as it is. It's showing people what it is that you're doing. talking about how many deals you've done, like your renovation, showing people like your wins, but also showing them how you've overcome problems as well so that people can see that you're a good person to work with. just documenting your journey. And I think one thing you said there about you've got the deal and you're looking for the investor, but waiting until that point to start posting, it's almost too late. You need to be... warming people up. So if you're thinking right in a year's time I'm probably going to need some funds, start posting now, start warming them people up so that you've already attracted them when you are ready to sort of go out with a sale. I'm so glad you said that. I'm so, glad you said that. So you're 100 % correct. You are right. It would be too late by then because let's face it, when you find the deal, you maybe have about two, three weeks before that person then sort of moves on as it were. And you can't really find, it's very difficult for a cold lead to convert in that period of time. Warm leads are much better. So I'll tell you the question I get asked quite a lot. And this is predominantly for social media in general, but let's use it for LinkedIn as the example. is they say, look, I'm at the beginning of my journey. I'm not, don't like, what should I be posting? I don't even have anything to post. And I always talk about documenting the journey and they're like, yeah, but what am I documenting? Like me at my computer looking at right move me, you know, like doing admin or drinking tea, like what should I be posting? So if we were thinking about the person who's nodding along, listening to this podcast going, yeah, beginning of my journey, what the... What the should I be posting? Have you got any advice for what they could document? Yeah so I think everything like obviously if you're out on viewings like some posts that did really well for me is like when you you go into a house that's like a probate property and they've usually got carpets with swirls in them and flowers and they've got funky wallpaper on the wall so things like that. Yeah exactly people yeah they go crazy for the for the bathroom things so anything like that can do well. I've had a few posts that have done really well on on LinkedIn where I've seen something on Right Move that's been in London and it's been a three bed terraced house and it's a million pounds and sort of comparing that to like, well, we only pay about 120 ,000 for a house like that where we are. And again, that's one of those types of posts that you divide in people's opinions. Some people say, well, if it's in London, it's worth that. And other people say, well, it shouldn't be worth that no matter where it is. did one, I posted one, I think I'd seen it on Facebook and it was a house that they painted black and people were like, some people loved the black paint, other people absolutely hated it and again it just got people talking in the comments. So they're things you can just see while you're scrolling right move. One I've seen recently was a house that had been painted, somebody had... painted all the walls with Disney characters, sort of like with spray paint and I saw that going around on Facebook. So yeah, just keep an eye out on other things like what's trending. One thing I think works really well is sharing your story and your values. So I told you about my husband and I have shared that story on my LinkedIn and tell people about it because it's a big part of who I am and how I've got to where I am. So don't be afraid to tell people about why you're doing what you're doing and tell them about what your values are, what your aims are for the future, like why are you doing all this hard work and then people will be able to relate to that and see what type of person you are. I find that so much more powerful, know, when people tell stories, first of all, it humanizes them and also people can then relate a lot easier. And I just think stories just tell a thousand words. Like I would rather hear someone's story than hear about their multi, multi millions, you know? I'm like, okay, fine, whatever. I'm like, tell me about you. Like, who are you? What do you enjoy? Like, what don't you enjoy? Like, it's just so much more interesting. I totally agree with that. I always say to people also, when they're first starting out, I always get them to show me five inspirational posts or five inspirational accounts that they follow. And they come back to me and they're like, I really like this person's profile. And I say, why? And they say, because they put this out there, they put this out there. And I'm like, great, then use that, use that for yourself because you've enjoyed their content. How could you replicate that? What could you be doing? And I totally agree with you. you know, if you don't have the viewings yet, if you don't have the direct vendor templates that you're putting through a letterbox yet, like tell your story. I mentor someone who wants to get into social housing, for example, and she's very, she's brilliant. And she wants to create really ethical homes for people to live in. That's her thing is, is being really ethical property saucer. So I said to her, well, why don't you post about why that's so important to you? Why don't you post about what the position at the moment is in the industry regarding social housing and being ethical. start positioning yourself as that. So I think there's always something to post. When people always say to me, what should I be posting? I'm like, just think. You know. of the things that I've posted quite a lot about is so I do kickboxing and last year I got my black belt in kickboxing. I'd been, I started, so I did karate as a teenager and I started back up doing martial arts during lockdown and I was doing it virtually in my living room. So I shared that on LinkedIn and people were like, wow, what type of martial arts are you doing? I used to do martial arts as a kid. My kids do martial arts. And then as I progressed through the belts, I shared like the hurdles, I got kidney stones, I couldn't train for a while, we had to be able to run 5k in under 30 minutes and I hate running, so that was a real, like that was really difficult for me. And people supported me along the journey and encouraged me and then when I got my black belt, they celebrated with me. And it gives that, like people feel like they know you because you're giving them that insight into your world and what it's like. So then when you meet them in real life or they get on a call with you, they already feel like they've met you before. Exactly. my God, no one's going to mess with you with your black belt, are they? And actually, do know what? That leads us beautifully onto my final sort of question I wanted to talk to you about, Rochelle, just because I know that you've been involved in previous property communities, specifically for women before. How have you found for yourself over these past four years, five years that you've been in the property, how have you found being a woman or a female in the industry in terms of... speaking opportunities or trying to attract investors and how investors see you and how you kind of show up. What has it been like for you? I think in terms of like the investors, think especially early on, it's always been very difficult to know why is this person gravitating towards me? Is it because they're genuinely interested in property or are they interested in something else? Especially when I was a single mum and I was talking about being a single mum on social media. So that was something that I've always found quite difficult just to know what people's intentions are. But other than that, think I've loved it. think people probably underestimate you and they see young women doing property. I can remember going into an of property and was the landlord showing me around and he was telling me all about how he'd been in property 20 years and he'd done 10 refurbs and I was like, I've done 12 this year. That was a nice confidence boost. because he was telling me all these things about property and I was like actually yes you've been doing it a lot longer but my journey has been a lot shorter than yours but I've done more in that short period of time so that was nice and then yeah you mentioned about the property community actually I set up a women's networking group with one of my friends and the reason we did it was because not I'm I love being around men, to be honest. I enjoy being around men and women, but we wanted to start a group mainly during the day because I struggle to get to networking events in the evening because of the children and I don't want to be out of the house all the time. And I wasn't getting any networking done because they're all in the evening. So I thought, well, if we can start some sort of coffee morning where we can all just get together and... have a chat and make it more informal, but at a time where people, women who were working full time in property can come without having to worry about childcare. And it started off where a few people just asked to meet me regularly. And I thought, I've not got time to meet everybody separately. So let's just all get together. And it started off with just six of us and quickly grew to. 20 or so people come into each meeting and a WhatsApp group with 100 plus women in it and I've stepped away from running it now but I still attend it regularly and yeah it's mainly that being in the daytime and knowing that you're around like -minded people. I love that. And you made such a good point earlier. I find it a really interesting when you know when this is only no, this has been going on for some time, but I'm only beginning to notice it recently. So when when we're asked about our female property groups, and you did it as well, and I used to do it quite a lot. First thing you'll say is, look, I really like men, and I'm really interested in men, and I've got nothing against men. And it's like, why do we have to start with that sentence? Because And I'll tell you why, because I, not so much anymore because I just shoot them down within about 20 seconds. But at the beginning, like I used to get so many guys, and dare I say in a really kind of, what's the right word to use? just ridiculous. Like, I don't know what the right word to use is ridiculous way night. I'm trying to think of the right word here to say things like, as, so how come you've got like a female only group? What have you got against men? And I'm like, Dare I say this, it actually has nothing to do with you and men, has nothing to do with you whatsoever. It's to do with women and it's to do with empowering women, which is a completely separate conversation to segregating men. The two conversations don't actually come together. And it's so interesting when I speak to other women, I've stopped doing it now, but when I speak to other women, they always start with, look, I've got nothing against men, like I really like men. And it's like, Why do we feel we have to start with that sentence, which is what I used to do? And it's fascinating because I think if you had like a male only group, I don't think they'd ever be like, look, I've got nothing against women. And I speak to so many females and I think it's beautiful. really do. And we are so underrepresented in this industry and I sort of go in waves with it, if I'm honest with you. Like one week, if you ask me, I'm like, yeah, think we're really like the change is really coming and I can really see like loads happening. And I can see the change happening. Like I really can. And I hope to be at the forefront of it as I'm sure you all Rochelle. But at the same time, I saw a photo recently on LinkedIn, funny enough, is where I saw the photo and it was, they were doing an award thing or judging an award show coming up. And it was the C, it was like, I don't know, like 15 of them, let's say, and 13 were men and two were women for a property award judging panel. And I was like, huh, okay, that's really interesting. And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it should be 50 -50, like if of course the caliber of the people are right to be there because that's their profession, then that's who should be there, absolutely. but it was such a big divide, 13 to two, that I'm like, it's just really noticeable, I feel. I actually did a post about it. It was an event, we're a good few months back now and it was a property event and it was all men and all white men as well. So it was like there being no, I don't think there was anything malicious behind it, but there was no, also no thought put. put behind it either. It's like if you know that everybody who suggests this networking event is a white man, then you should be thinking about, okay, how can I diversify this to not only make people feel comfortable, but to attract other people into like, it's something that I probably wouldn't feel comfortable going to if I knew that, and it was a large event as well. Like you say, similar to what you mentioned, there was 10 or 12 men there. It wasn't just that there were two men speaking, like that's. I don't expect there to be like events where two men don't speak, but if you've got 10 or 12 people and they're all white male, you need to start getting in some different opinions and different like there's plenty of women in property, even if they'd have contacted someone like you who runs a property networking event, like who do you know who can speak about this topic that we can get into to make this line up more diverse and. more welcoming to everybody. And I have to say I have had those conversations now more and more. So I actually do get approached quite a bit. One for me to actually go and speak. I've got quite a lot of speaking events coming up, which I'm really excited about. But also they do say to me, could you please recommend somebody who is in this particular sector that you know of? And I, course know a lot of women in property just naturally. And so I'm therefore able to put them forward for that opportunity. So. It is great and a lot of the guys are really forward thinking. There are a few of them that really get it. But then you're going to have that odd guy who says, I've been in property 20 years and I've done 10 renovations. And you're like, good for you. And I love the fact you've done 12 in a year. That is so poetic. It's just beautiful. But I love that. And I think we just keep pushing forward. We just keep turning up, showing what we're doing, showing our credibility. and just being the change we want to see, that's what I always say. Just be the change you want to see, show up the way you would, and treat others the way you would want to be treated, I think is always the ethos. But yeah, I've loved today's conversation, Rochelle. Like, thank you so much. And I'm actually going to go change my LinkedIn profile off the back of this conversation. I'm like, right, I need to up my game. If people wanted to work with you and people wanted to get in touch to know more information or even They're based in Sheffield and around your area. Where is the best place for people to find you? So on LinkedIn, I talk all about property on there. So happy for you to connect with me on there and drop me a message. On Facebook, I talk all about LinkedIn training, posting on LinkedIn. And I've got a group on there as well. So if you're interested in learning more about LinkedIn, you can connect with me on there and join my group. So if you just search Rochelle Gilbert, I think I'm the only one in the world which I quite like. I've found another one. So yeah, just search. that. you'll be able to find me. What's the name of the group if they wanted to join the group? Bet invisible on LinkedIn. Okay, perfect, lovely, thank you for that. And as always, if you wanna connect with me, I'm Athena Dobson, underscore official, Girls in Property on Instagram. If you wanna have a look at our website with all the information about the community and the gala, it's girlsinproperty .co .uk. And then don't forget, we've got the community group as well. We meet on the first Tuesday online every single month for Girls in Prosperity, which is all about learning about business. And again, we've got 17 members now in that community group growing rapidly, which is great. And I'll be doing more announcements about the 10 locations and announcing those over probably the end of the the year and into next. we've also got the gala at the end of the year, which is on Saturday, the 7th of December. So if you're a female in property and wanting to have a really great night dance floor, would be so much fun. casino vibes, there's going to be like 80 to a hundred women. So just come have a laugh. Meet like -minded women will be great. And then finally, if you're getting into property and you want help with your mindset and learning more and just getting started. Then I offer a mindset accelerator course with me talking, worksheets, everything completely free of charge, DMing the word mindset and I will happily send that over to you. But Rochelle, thank you so much for your time today. I've loved it and I'm sure people would have really picked up so many good tips and just keep smashing it. Keep doing you, being the most amazing mum and yeah, thank you again and have the most amazing week. Thanks for having me. Thanks guys, enjoy your week. Bye!